Smile! You’re on

What could be better than a gorgeous Arizona day to demonstrate your latest and greatest “talivan” equipment? Having CameraFRAUD volunteers show up within minutes to conduct a little bit of counter-surveillance of their own.

The demonstration, which included a handful of American Traffic Solutions employees, didn’t go as planned when they became the subject of sidewalk photography.

At the time of writing, CameraFRAUD has almost 1,400 members, outnumbering ATS and Redflex’s Arizona staff combined.

It’s simple. Defraud the public: Get your picture posted on CameraFRAUD.

58 Responses to Smile! You’re on

  1. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    so did they shake with fear and run at the sight of the camera? did they poop their pants…. seriously, why dont you leave the employee’s alone… they are just making a living… did you stay and get arrested for obstructing justice… i simply would have called the cops on you if you did not leave when i asked you nicely… i would have asked twice just to be kind!!! dont know what the cops would have done… but i am sure they would have found something to charge you with .. obstruction of something!!!

  2. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    did you show them your official CAMERA FRAUD badge!!!

  3. camerafraud says:

    LAB wrote: “i simply would have called the cops on you if you did not leave when i asked you nicely…”

    Can’t directly answer your questions considering this was volunteer-submitted, but do you usually make a habit of calling the cops on people who’re on a public sidewalk? What crime is being committed?

    “…i would have asked twice just to be kind!!! dont know what the cops would have done… but i am sure they would have found something to charge you with .. obstruction of something!!!”

    As you’re someone who admits to being employed by ATS, is this your admission that your company has a policy to file false police reports and use underhanded tactics to quell dissent?

  4. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    I HAVE NEVER ADMITTED THAT !!! NEVER cause it is not true…show me the post where i did.. come on…

    as i wrote … the camera fraud officer i am sure was obstructing something… had it been me, i would have called the cops if you got in the way of me doing my job… and i would not be the one filing a police report … that would be up to the officer… along with either charging someone or doing nothing… either way i am sure that an officer would have asked the camera fraud cop to let the person do his job!!

  5. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    and how do we know it is an employees car? oh thats right…. you wrote it, hell it must be true!!!

    excuse me while i puke!!!

  6. camerafraud says:

    Looked it up on the backend, the post where “you” said you worked for ATS wasn’t your IP and has been removed. My apologies.

    That still doesn’t answer the question as to why you would call the police for someone taking pictures in a public place. Isn’t that the argument used by proponents of automated ticketing– no expectation of privacy?

  7. camerafraud says:

    >>”and how do we know it is an employees car? oh thats right…. you wrote it, hell it must be true!!!”

    Well, I’m assuming the volunteers didn’t snap their own car, so by process of elimination it’s a safe bet that car belongs to someone there watching the demonstration.

    >>”excuse me while i puke!!!”

    Why does logic make you want to puke? Too much Ka-band radiation? 🙂

  8. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    why would an employee drive their car AND the van to the site? for all we know that car belongs to the old man that walks around the park that is located near there… or… it is the car of one of those other people pictured … and maybe one of them is a state employee, or the person that owns that car is working for ” keep the cameras ” and they are there to observe… there could be any number explanations as to whom that car belongs to…. someone took the liberty of assuming it was an amployees and for no other purpose than to pass it off as fact!!!

    lies and inuendo make me want to puke… what you are doing is as fraudulent as the people you accuse of acting the same!!!

  9. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    just how many does ats and red flex employ? i wonder because the message implies that you know.. or is this just another guess? passed off as fact…

    i would be able to find out… BUT I DONT WORK THERE

  10. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    it certainly is not irony… one group is trying to do what they are employed to do…. set up a mobile camera to take pictures of motorists who go over the posted speed limit…. the other is a person or persons taking pictures for no real purpose other than to show everyone that he-she knows how to use a camera while trying to make it look as though they have caught a criminal in the act!!! of wrong doing!!

    irony would have best been described if the camera fraud officer had caught the mobile camera van speeding!!! THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN IRONY!!

  11. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    not about that matt… if they were to get in the way of me doing my job…. i am calling the cops…. now remember i said getting in the way of me doing my job!!! snap pictures all you want … i find it funny this person was covering his face!!! i would even smile for you guys!!! and flash with hand signals the speed i have the camera set at!!! wouldnt that be fun!!!???

  12. Doc says:

    would you, could you, call the cops if I offered you green eggs and ham? “I do not like them” in a talivan! I do not like them in the U.S.; I do not like them while I’m in distress! I work, I work, for ATS! I do not like you being FREE; I do not lik it, don’t you see? on, & on, & on…
    Didn’t I fire you on another thread?!?! What are you doing still posting on this site?!?!? Aren’t you supposed to be on a one way flight to china?!?!?
    Now, go lay down and clean yourself! Bad monkey! Bad monkey!!

  13. Glyph says:

    Kudos to the observant, level-headed person who saw this little demonstration, recognized it for what it was, then stood in the face of those scamera thugs and took all these great pictures…

    We’re everywhere!

  14. guttersn1pe says:

    Redflex employs approximately 470 according to their published report in August 2008:

    Click to access 2008-08-26%20Investor%20Briefing%20Aug%2008.pdf

    ATS employs about 425 according to this article from 2008:

    470 + 425 = 895 < 1400

  15. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    sorry doc..matt acknowleged that i in fact do not work for redflex or ats… so that accusation is done!!

    yes glyph it was almost as if they took a gun, went to iraq or afghanistan, stood a post and fought for our freedom….

    i tell you from the pictures i saw posted those thugs were just moments from grabbing him and his camera cause they were doing illegal things… i dont know how this brave soul escaped with his life!!! i can only hope that as he sped away … he didnt get snapped with the speed camera…

    you are everywhere and knowhere at all!!! and you guys are certainly.. OUT THERE!!!

  16. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    COOL IT WAS NOT JUST A GUESS.. i would say then that congradulations are in order…. you beat those cameras guys at something… make sure that gets on the signs for the next rally!!! you could even do a chant to it////

    we have more employees than you do..( repeat it 4-5 times)
    more employees and a chant… you guys rock!!!

  17. Doc says:

    bad monkey bad monkey bad monkey bad monkey bad monkey
    I’ve met Matt, I’ve got a ton of respect for him, but I still think you’re an employee of the totalitarianists/communists! You need to get off of this site & getchur a$$ on the boat 2 china like I told you to, you sLACker!!! Your mom is ashamed of you

  18. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    did you shake his hand? you didnt wash it after that did you? believe what you want… i really dont care.. matt said it and it must be true!!!

    i like matt!!!

  19. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    do you think i can get my own blog on this site.. you know .. the differing opinion? i think it would be good for the site… i am sure that i would draw much interest…

  20. guttersn1pe says:

    LAB – you post here often enough – I thought this was your blog. I’m sure there must be a pro-camera blog out there somewhere. Well – I just ran a search. I found plenty of anti-camera blogs but none in support. I guess it’s just you.

    Good thing your employer has too many employees to keep an eye on what they’re all doing.

  21. camerafraud says:

    You want to be the Colmes to our Hannity?


    (And I can’t believe I just compared us to Hannity…)

    I suppose we could give you contributor access. Email us at

  22. This is Matt says:

    I think its funny that Law A. Biding Citizen thinks Matt controls all the posts on the main camerafraud site. There’s a lot more people involved in Camerafraud than just Matt. I appreciate all the compliments though !!

  23. Adam says:

    Keep up the good work.

  24. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    well matt .. i dont think you have called me any names yet!!! therefore i like you…

    i dont have a problem with any of you… we just have a difference of opinions…

    i even like doc… but i think he is up tight probably tough day at work…. he just got home…

  25. Scott says:

    I find it funny that someone would write a post bashing the people that took those pictures, yet they don’t appear to mind when the government snaps pics and video of them constantly (or they would understand the above gesture). On top of that they posted on an anti-camera site, what response where they looking for? They just want to pick fights I guess.
    As for the people taking time to get involved and fight for our rights to privacy, I applaud you. It seems to me that we as a society have been dumbed down and taken advantage of for too long. If we want something enough, we can get it if we fight for it. That is how the USA started. Our founding fathers were bad asses that truly wanted a country FOR the people BY the people. President Thomas Jefferson said, “I sincerely believe, with you, that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies; and that the principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale.” A proper government, for Jefferson, is one that not only prohibits individuals in society from infringing on the liberty of other individuals, but also restrains itself from diminishing individual liberty.
    Keep up the good work!

  26. I'm Back says:

    Coconino County to begin charging drivers to contest photo generated tickets:

  27. Scott says:

    LA, there are several “docs” in this group 🙂

  28. Mike says:

    I’ve taken a gun to Iraq to protect the freedom of this country, and I thank the members of CameraFraud for doing the same here. My hat goes of to all of you.

  29. Glyph says:

    Thank you Mike. I’ve said on another forum that I’ve never been in such good company, and that’s because I get to be around folks like you.

    But our hats are off to you for all you do. If you’re overseas right now, don’t worry ’cause we’ll leave just a couple cameras for you to knock down when you get back =)

  30. radarhunter says:

    What a great demonstration.. Seems they’re just fine snapping shots of us all day but not to keen on they reversal.

    Radar Hunter

  31. duece says:

    Way to harass the working man. Leave the employees alone. At least they are doing something positive for their community. Why dont you people quit wasting your time and concentrate your efforts towards something positive.

  32. geez says:

    It’s just like childish gang members. Each person is constantly trying to outdue the other, to satisfy their ‘hero’ complex.
    “Look! I got video of a photoradar driver! I’m gonna be the hero of the day! I have such a need to impress others, and today is my day! Their gonna think I’m SO cool, thank god cause no one else really gives a crud about me..”

  33. PhotoRadarScam says:

    What are they doing that is positive for the community? Cameras cause an INCREASE in accidents!

  34. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    scott- i believe that i was bashing whoever wrote the captions…. well i guess i questioned the motives of the person who took them… i mean really.. what was there to prove…. they took pictures of a person doing their job!!! now that is a smoking gun!!!

  35. Kenny S> says:

    I love blowing the horn just when I’m at the side of the van!
    I may even upgrade my horns with some louder models from harbor freight.
    I can imagine the jump whe nthey hear it tucked away behind the silver curtains.

  36. Scott says:

    LA- I don’t think its a matter of something to prove, as much as its making a statement. It really is no different than the cameras on the side of the road, snapping photos of citizens all day and night long. A few people mentioned leaving the employees alone. I agree that it would be embarrassing and annoying to have someone come up and take pictures of you while working, but that’s what the Scameras are doing too. There are many people who’s jobs are to be on the road, truck drivers, delivery drivers, couriers, and many others if you think about it long enough. These people endure the same actions those ATS employees had, while just trying to get their job done. I understand and appreciate that you are a law abiding citizen, but just because its a law doesn’t make it right. If there was a law passed (without your vote) that a curfew was enacted so you could no longer leave your house after 8pm everyday (for no apparent reason), would you abide that law? Or stand up? When governments make laws, we are led to believe that these laws are made to enhance people’s lives. In truth, laws are byproducts of insufficiency. Laws, at best, are attempts to control a population, and work only sporadically with great expense and hardship. All man-made laws are developed to preserve the established order. But laws never get to the root of problems, and they are continuously violated, even by those who make them.

  37. PhotoRadarScam says:

    Most crimes are committed at night, so in the interest of safety maybe we should have an 8pm curfew! Then everyone you see out past 8 is a criminal and the police can arrest them.

  38. Scott says:

    One more thing about laws for everyone to think about… It isn’t thought about much now, but what about Rosa Parks, she didn’t sit in the back of the bus because some person or government told her too, and in turn sparked the Montgomery Bus Boycott. She believed every human has certain rights, and she stood up! Now she is looked at as a human rights icon, but before her defiance, that was not the case. I believe we have certain rights that we are entitled to just for being human, not because a government says I can have that right. I dare all of you to research Thomas Jefferson, he was wise beyond his years… In the Preamble to his original draft of the Declaration of Independence, Jefferson wrote:

    “We hold these truths to be sacred & undeniable; that all men are created equal & independent, that from that equal creation they derive rights inherent & inalienable, among which are the preservation of life, & liberty, & the pursuit of happiness; that to secure these ends, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed; that whenever any form of government shall become destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, & to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles & organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety & happiness”

    This was written by an American President. Think about it…

  39. Dan G says:

    Deuce said:
    “Way to harass the working man. Leave the employees alone. At least they are doing something positive for their community. Why don’t you people quit wasting your time and concentrate your efforts towards something positive.”

    To redflex employees I say:
    “Way to harass the working man. Leave the taxpayers alone. At least they are doing something positive for their community. Why don’t you people quit violating our constitutional rights and concentrate your efforts towards something positive?”

  40. Dan G says:

    People, keep snapping photos of these people who violate our rights on a daily basis. Ever hear of the “Speed Camera Pimping Game”?? If that ever catches on here, it would totally invalidate the cameras. Here’s a website with some ‘interesting’ fonts to download:

  41. PhotoRadarScam says:

    I’ve already ordered all customized plates with the Golden Rule plate design. This design has very little contrast between the plate background and the letters making it difficult to view. I also succeeded in obtaining a customized expression which is meaningless, but combines a few 0s, Os, and Ds (zero, Oh, and Dee) making it even more difficult to read the plate correctly. The zero and O are virtually identical. I suggest you all do the same.

  42. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    scott- laws that govern speed have been around as long as their have been cars.. and law enforcement has spent as much time trying to uphold the laws that govern speeding… you are the first person i have seen infer that speeding should not be regulated or laws that regulate speeding are stupid.. i agree there are some laws that are stupid ( the license plate holer law) and some that are outdated ( infidelity laws still on the books) fyi.. i took my license plate holder off.. i dont want to be pulled over… it was simple… i didnt agree but what the hell!!

    without laws we are not a civlilized society… have you ever driven in nogales, mexico….if they have laws that regulate drivers they are not enforced… is that what you want?

    people that are paid to drive are expected to follow the laws in regards to speeding… those who work for large corporations are not allowed, by law, to reveal insider information that would enable someone to profit or avoid loss… and i can go on and on.. bank tellers are not suppose to take money from the till!!! so if you drive for a living and you speed in front of a camera… you deserve the ticket… the people that set up the camera vans ARE NOT breaking any laws….

  43. PhotoRadarScam says:

    Yes the van operators are breaking at least 2 laws:
    1. Working as private investigators without a PI license. (ARS 32-2411)
    2. Illegally parked along side of the controlled-access highway (ARS 28-871)

  44. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    well since i am not a cop i can not say this for sure .. but i can speculate…

    1. the company they work for is contracted BY THE STATE OF ARIZONA to conduct this business and either they are not required to have one as a company or maybe they do have one… but i would have to believe that if they needed a PI license the individuals would have them.

    2. with the above in mind, and acting in the role of some type of law enforcement.. when it comes to where they set up, they are exempt from those laws just as a cop is not bound by them!!!

    i mean .. as one of you mentioned… you have a cop friend that seems to have talked to every other cop in town and says that ALL cops hate the cameras… well if ALL the cops hated the cameras.. dont you think they would be enforcing those 2 laws?

    does that mean that a cop has to have a pi license also?

  45. Dan G says:

    Well LAB rat, you’re missing one vital point, as always.

    Our rights, such as due process, are not mere inconveniences to be discarded whenever the state needs money to make up for the ineptitude of its officials. These cameras violate that right, as well as your right to face your accuser in a court of law. Let’s not forget the indignity of whether or not you’re falsely accused (it does happen). Yes, we all know they RETURN the money paid as you have mentioned before. But you left out that it’s not until someone first fights and proves machine error in a court of law. What’s the penalty for stealing someone’s time, money, or both?

    It’s okay for the state to steal our money, but I’ll get arrested for robbing Circle K?

  46. Scott says:

    LA- Here is a site to look at that explains the opposite end of the spectrum in regards to laws…

  47. Malfeasant says:

    “but i would have to believe that if they needed a PI license the individuals would have them.”
    as someone said earlier, you will be easy to take advantage of.

    “does that mean that a cop has to have a pi license also?”
    no, because a cop is not a private investigator, but an employee of the public sector

  48. Joe says:

    Dan G wrote:

    “These cameras violate that right, as well as your right to face your accuser in a court of law.”

    You are referring to the confrontation clause of the Constitution’s 6th amendment. I think one of the unfortunate loopholes that exist is the fact that the clause refers specifically to criminal charges. I think the fact that these cases are considered “infractions” and not criminal is what (currently) keeps photo radar in legal safety. It would take a high court to see the definition of “criminal” rather broadly. I’m actually on your side. A similar post I made on this point was unfortunately removed a few days ago. My belief is that if we’re going to fight this, we should actually read the constitution.

    Now the AZ State constitution could actually have language that works in our favor, but I’m not sure which section covers that. Anyone?

  49. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    dan- did you see the collapse of the economy? … i am certainly not a fan of our elected officials… but before you throw them under the bus… the reason for the cut backs is due to the taxe $$ that are not being generated… which has everything to do with the economy… but we know you saw it coming right dan!!! why didnt you just say something to everybody? you could have stopped this entire mess from happening!!!

  50. PhotoRadarScam says:

    LAC, you really should do your research before you spout off such nonsense. The laws state specific exclusions for police officers. There are no exclusions for private contractors and/or vendors to the state or DPS. Just having a contract with DPS doesn’t exempt you from the laws. DPS still has to hire licensed contractors, licensed lawyers, and licensed everything else. Did you lear anything about law and the constitution when you were in school?

  51. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    no man i went to redneck elementry and hillbilly high!!! but i tell you what they did teach us.. TO READ and understand what we read. now you may want to reread my post ..cause i never passed it off as fact i was simply posing a question and speculating!!!.. notice the last sentence??? #%#^%$#&$& duh!!!

    and if the cops are sooooooo anti cameras as many of you claim… why are they not enforcing the laws???
    they must be like glyph… missing a set!!!!

    i would be curious to know where their union stood on this issue!!! think i will check it out!!!!

  52. geez says:

    Oh, like the actual real dps officer I talked to?
    He told me he worked dui patrol, and before the camera’s, he was constantly pulled OFF dui to work serious accidents and to run radar where he consistently got people at 100+. Now, in the past three months, he rarely gets called off to work accidents and the rare times he’s ran radar, he hasn’t had a 100+ in a couple months. He was thrilled the camera’s were out there, to allow him to concentrate on serious issues like his DUI taskforce.

  53. Jimmy says:


    Maybe that is because as a country, we are traveling millions of miles less that we use to, 3.6 million less people traveling to work every day, $4.00 a gallon gas kept a lot of people at home because they had no money.

  54. geez says:

    Such crap Jimmy
    Ya’ll say DPS’s stats are crap, when DPS says accidents have dropped from the same time last year, because people are driving less. Where the heck you been the last couple months Jimmy? Where all you been? The last couple months gas has DROPPED like a rock compared to LAST YEARS $4 a gallon! Last Year! In the time DPS Photo Radar came on, gas dropped like a rock and people started driving more! In the time this officer I was talking about was getting pulled of DUI enforcement was when gas was near it’s high, when people were driving less! NOW when gas is low, people driving more, SINCE photo radar came into place, he is being pulled off DUI rarely.
    But ya, ya’ll are gonna twist it to however you can get the public all roused up.

  55. Law A. Bidingcitizen says:

    photo radar fraud pundits must be talking to the cops that enjoy sitting in their cars, eating donuts, talking to the wife or girlfriend or both, sleeping and every once in awhile pulling someone over and writing a ticket…. god forbid they get out of the car and do some real LE… the cameras allow them to do something more than speed enforcement …

  56. No One says:

    Excuse me?

    Please post where any of the above comes from, as I did not see it. I have nothing but respect for the members of law enforcement, and I do not recall anyone here posting such disparaging comments in the time I have been here– which, incidentally, is several times longer than you. As a whole, I see most people here are pro law enforcement officers and would appreciate your pointing out where you get this from or cease in your putting words into others’ mouths.

  57. Jimmy says:

    geez, enough with the BS,

    I don’t know what you do for a living, but I average 125 mile a day on the valley streets and there is a lot less traffic now then there use to be. I don’t sit in traffic now where near as much as I use to. Even with gas dropping, people are not driving like they used to because they DO NOT HAVE THE MONEY EVEN AT $2.00 A GALLON!!! I had a college instructor tell me once, liars figure and figures lie, so they can twist around all the stats they what but they need to tell the whole truth.

  58. No One says:

    If there’s one thing the summer’s gas price hies were good for, it’s helping people adjust their habits. My wife and I started carpooling since we don’t work terribly far away from one another and we haven’t gone back.

    Also I’d expect a lot of seniors who would normally come here for the winter are staying home because with their pensions and 40k’s taking a nosedive, who’s got money for a trip?

    I’ve not seen any statistics one way or another but my perception is an overall lower volume. (If anyone has a link handy, I’d be glad to see it)

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: